It used to bother me when I was called a heretic, a spiritual mad man, a cult leader, and the worst of all names, a NEW AGER! Man, when you get nailed with a NEW AGE tag or maybe someone who is closely associated with Unity, you’re to be shunned and despised BIG TIME! Remember that historical figure that was a crazy subversive teacher, a wine bibber, and one who fellowshipped with tax collectors and prostitutes? Sure you do!
His name was Jesus! Some refer to him s JAY-ZUS or GEE……Zaas!
Why, he was so radical and such a threat to the religious leaders of the day (like the religious leaders of 2009) that he had to be removed, taken out of the picture, and crucified! For God’s sake, this man needed to be silenced because he was preaching a social gospel of grace, mercy, freedom, forgiveness, healing on the Sabbath, and all manner of concepts that flew in the face of the religious authorities.
The government (Rome) wasn’t nearly as concerned as were the religious leaders.
Jesus was a threat to the ESTABLISHMENT! He wasn’t following the LETTER of the LAW. In fact, he was replacing the LAW with his idea of a spiritual KINGDOM wherein the religious leaders would lose their control and authority over what people believed and thus how they behaved. God forbid that things go out of control lest people might worship God on any day of the week, have communion whenever they wanted, interpret the Scriptures (at that time it was just the Hebrew Scriptures) as their conscience told them.
Jesus was a mad man and a heretic!
So today, it’s okay to SAY that you are a Christian as long as you obey the Christian authorities (the one particular flavor that you belong to) and not question a thing. If you thought Constantine was heavy handed in 325 at the Council of Nicea, it’s only because you’d not heard what emperor Theodosius had to say at the Council of Constantinople (380-81), “We REQUIRE that those who embrace the name of Catholic Christians adjudge ALL others as MAD MEN and order them to be designed at HERETICS.”
Not a lot has changed in 1700+ years.
And don’t be fooled by the name “ecumenical council”. whose aim it as to FORCE a common doctrine on ALL whether they liked it or not. It’s a spirit that still with us today: however, it goes by the CODE NAMES of inerrant, infallible, and fundamentalist. Have you ever heard those code names before? 
I heard someone today refer to themselves as a Post-Christian. I am pondering the implications of this badge. I’m not one for labels, but they seem to reappear periodically in my life. Post-Christian seems to refer to someone that has discover a new direction for traditional Christianity, Christianity without the formerly attached labels we grew up with. What’s your opinion, Ernie?
Don: Everything is POST and unfortunately much is TOAST as well! Church, as we’ve known it, is TOAST. Just how far burned that toast is depends upon how much LOVE it can administer to cover the burns of LAW. One of the best books that I read 2-3 years ago was Dave Tomlinson’s, “The Post-Evagelical“. We now live (since 1987) in what’s called a POST modern world. So, think it not strange that Post-Christian would be on the horizon. As for MOI? I am a “follower of Jesus” and a member of the Christian community which is INCLUSIVE of ALL (which we call a LIFE Revealing Community).
Ernie what do you tell people about the crucifixion? To me it seems like God knew it was comming as references in OT are numerous. I know in the past, your position was it was man’s idea and man ordained to kill anyone who just gave them too much trouble. That makes sense according to what you just wrote, but where is the comfort from history that Jesus died for our sins, when in fact it didn’t look that way at all. It looked like he was just too good for the temple big shots and they were jealous. Having said that, when Jesus said it was for their good that he go away, how has it been good, and where is the authority of power and miracles that his disciples performed? I sort of doubt they all achieved “christos” also. I know you have answered this in various ways before, but I just dont have an answer that sticks yet. Also would like to know if he was able to “escape” some of the suffering as other men that were crucified did since he was able to seperate his spirit from his flesh in more than once before ….. disappearing in crowds etc I KNOW that is not a nice question to ask. IT seems like christianity dweels on his terrible suffering and yet suffering was not the price of sin. That entire crucifion scene never look godly to me or even god ordained. It had the makings of man, jealous and crowd control.
JTar: Breaking centuries of religious indoctrination (or our individual respective few decades) is a tough task: even for those that want! I’m not trying to CHANGE anyone- JUST ME! Having said that, here is what I embrace and get from the “Spirit” of what JESUS said, as it is HE that I am attempting to follow- not Moses!
1-I don’t embrace the “dying for our sins” as the traditional church teaches it (because I once lied, I am now forgiven, and can go to heaven).
2-SIN isn’t in “external acts” but in the “false belief” that we are SEPARATED from God.
3-The crucifixion was evidence that we are ETERNAL beings and ONE with the Eternal One (God or whatever name you give to the Creator).
4-If Jesus didn’t take the path (His decision not that of a blood thirsty God- though God KNEW: like what does God not know?) he took how would we KNOW there’s an eternal life- Oneness: how would I know that I and ALL could become the Christos that he did?
5-Jesus was HUMAN! Nails hammered into a body cause PAIN (but in my definition of the distinctions between suffering and pain, e did not suffer but he did feel incredible pains).
In summary, does your THEOLOGY depict and demonstrate a LOVING GOD or a vengeful, retributive and scary God? The one Jesus spoke of (Abba Father) was the epitome of UNCONDITIONAL LOVE!
So do I understand this correctly? Crucifixion was never God’s idea or plan EVER? (sure doesnt look that way when you examine the proper way a sacrifice was to be done…. very little to no pain involved at all – that was even the God of the Law’s way) Crucixion was always man’s way of disgracefully disposing of tyrants? It wasn’t even JEWISH. Something miraculous is happening in me this very moment. This has been a HUGE thing for me to get over. It was at the core of my salvation decision because of the fear factor. So many FACTS written in what I considered the perfect presentation of the God we thought existed, and in fact he was only the one we created. I can say it and explain it and talk it, but until this change began going on deeply inside me, I was caught in the middle.
Thank you.
JTar:
1-God’s plan is that we live lives of unconditional LOVE as God is LOVE!
2-Unconditional love means unconditional freedom (free will) which is the antithesis of church culture! Church culture won’t even allow you to ask serious questions that oppose their doctrines. A “thinking Christian” is quickly labeled: one of many not good descriptions.
3-We come to God out of LOVE (true inner being that we are) not form external church-imposed FEAR (be good or go to hell)
4-A familiarity with church history demonstrates that what most Christians BELIEVE today is NOT what Jesus represented. Most “Christians” today are not followers of Jesus, but “Paulinians” (which does not negate the GOOD that Paul brought), but does make the distinction between SPIRIT & LAW (church rules, doctrine, and dogma).
Ernie what did Jesus mean when He said about the beard and wine and do this in remberance of Me.
Love Dan
Dan: In ALL that we do, how we LIVE, BREATHE, EAT, DRINK, and EXIST we need to do from a perspective of the KINGDOM- not from some egoic-ecclesiastical paradigm! Churches have varied all over the landscape on this issue, from Catholic transubstantiation (literalness of the body of Jesus) to a casual reminder of His life. For me, the question real IS: What’s in your HEART when you REMEMBER & DO this rite? Like all spiritual (religious) experiences- how does this impact your personal life: and then let others SEE & BE involved in it as they chose.